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 1 
 on: 16 February 2018, 08:36:10 am 
Started by stevebecker - Last post by stevebecker
Jeff,

thanks again I always lean some thing new talking to you.

I had Ernie Mack down as B Sqn ? Troop on his prom after the Nek 7 Aug 1915, and Ed Wilson down as C Sqn ? Troop.

I surpose we could spend some days looking into the post Nek proms in both LH Regts (8th and 10th).

Cheers

S.B

 2 
 on: 15 February 2018, 08:19:13 pm 
Started by stevebecker - Last post by More Majorum
Steve,

The information on Bert Heath is a dit sparse, but from what I have found it would appear that he was originally in “A” Troop, “A” Sqdn. After his promotion to 2nd Lt on the 7th August it would seem that he was OC “A” Troop, “A” Sqdn for the 8th LH party that went out to Destryer Hill on the 9th August, this is confirmed by Sgt Ernie Mack who was 2nd in command of the party.
The 8th LH War Dairy of the 15/8/1915 states that 2nd Lt Heath was appointed OC “A” Troop, “B” Sqdn. This is confirmed by 2nd Lt Edward Wilson OC “D” Troop, “B” Sqdn on the 17/8/15.

Jeff

 3 
 on: 15 February 2018, 09:28:26 am 
Started by stevebecker - Last post by stevebecker
Jeff,

Thank you, always good to get your imput.

Yes I did readjust his record to show he was in hosp

BEATH   Herbert Henry   39   SSM   8 LHR   A Sqn prom 2/Lt A Sqn ? Troop 7-8-15 evac to (1 NZ SH) hosp (dysentry) 8-15 att rear Dtls 9-15 shown in Simpson WIA 19-9-15 at Canterbury Slope N/R? (G) rtn 12-15 shown T/OC A Sqn 1-16 prom Capt 2ic B Sqn (from hoare) 2-16 shown to C Sqn 3-16 rtn OC A Sqn 7-16 WIA 9-8-16 injured after horse being shot and fall on him in action at Bir el Abd att school of Instruction (cavalry course) Zeitoun 10-16 rtn 11-16 att transport duty Kantara 1-17 to OC DSqn/3 LHTR 2-17 att school of Instruction (unknown course) Zeitoun 5-17 rtn 6-17 to hosp (gastro) 8-17 to 3 LHTR 10-17 RTA disch 7-12-17 reported SNLR with Lt Oliver died TB at Caulfield Vic (Boer War Sth African Constabulary and Royston's Horse Natal Rebelion 1906)


I thought Simpson had seen something not in his records to give that comment?

Mate by the way did you find what Troop in A Sqn he took over post the Nek?

Cheers

S.B

 4 
 on: 14 February 2018, 11:36:01 am 
Started by stevebecker - Last post by More Majorum
Hi Steve,

I presume you have accessed Bert Heath’s Service Record, that will give you the confirmation of his war service.
Cameron Simpson has got it wrong for his wounding on the 19th Sept at Canterbury Slope, 2nd Lt. Heath was there, but evacuated to Egypt with Bronchitis and Dysentry on the 19th August onboard the H.S. “Guildford Castle”.  He arrived at Alexandria on the 23rd August and admitted to No. 1New Zealand Stationary Hospital at Sues on the 24th. He never returned to duty on Gallipoli.
There are two dates given in his Service Record for his promotion to Squadron Sergeant Major, the 3rd October and the 28th October 1914.
The 3rd Oct had me puzzled as the 8th LH had not come into being by that date, but the Service Record entry gives the Routine Order No. 5. I only have copies of the Routine Orders from No. 31, being the 29th Oct. a back count gives the 3rd as the correct date for number 5. As such, I have entered Heath as promoted to acting SSM for the 6th LH. The 8th LH Regt officially formed on the 17th Oct, which makes Heath’s promotion to SSM “A” Sqdn on the 28th also correct.
From what I can see, the rest of the details you have submitted are correct.

Jeff

 5 
 on: 11 February 2018, 09:25:37 am 
Started by stevebecker - Last post by stevebecker
Jeff,

Another for your interest?


Lt Beath is shown WIA by Simpson, but I don't see it, can you find any details on this?

BEATH   Herbert Henry   39   SSM   8 LHR   A Sqn prom 2/Lt A Sqn ? Troop 7-8-15 shown in Simpson WIA 19-9-15 at Canterbury Slope N/R? (G) shown T/OC A Sqn 1-16 prom Capt 2ic B Sqn (from hoare) 2-16 shown to C Sqn 3-16 rtn OC A Sqn 7-16 WIA 9-8-16 injured in horse fall after being shot at Bir el Abd att school of Instruction (cavalry course) Zeitoun 10-16 rtn 11-16 to OC DSqn/3 LHTR 2-17 att school of Instruction (unknown course) Zeitoun 5-17 rtn 6-17 disch 7-12-17 reported SNLR with Lt Oliver died TB at Caulfield Vic (Boer War Sth African Constabulary and Royston's Horse Natal Rebelion 1906)

Cheers

S.B

 6 
 on: 13 January 2018, 09:01:12 pm 
Started by stevebecker - Last post by More Majorum
Steve,

I have no information on the wounding of Sgt Vernon at Tolmans Post from my records. The only information is that that you have found from his Service Record.
From the 3rd LH Bde War Diary, the 12th LH Regt was attached to the Brigade on the 28th August at Aghyl Dere, and the 12th LH HQ being attached to the 8th LH Regt on the 29th August.
I can find nothing in the dairies to explain the circumstances of Sgt Vernon’s wounding.

Jeff

 7 
 on: 06 January 2018, 09:40:41 am 
Started by stevebecker - Last post by stevebecker
Jeff,

Thanks mate, nice one clears up many of the points.

You also pose another interesting one?

Hugh Wright

All the known records show he was wounded 3 June 1915, but the accounts all put pay to that record.

On closer check of his record we see that he did go to the 2 FAmb on the 26 May 1915 from scalp wound

Some time you have to look deeper into the known records instead of just the surface.

Nice one mate

Also if you show it I was after details on the wounding of Sgt Vernon

VERNON   Frederick Henry   22   Sgt/Tpt   12 LHR   RHQ Transport Sgt att RHQ/01 LHR 8-15 to 3 LH Bde HQ 10-15 att 8 LHR 10-15 reported WIA 19-11-15 shown WIA 20-11-15 R/knee shot at Tolmans Post evac to (15 BGH) hosp 11-15 (G) RTA wounded disch 9-10-16 (Boer War 3 NSWIB (65) (shown St Georges Rifles to possibly RHQ/11 LH Aust Horse CMF)

What was he doing with the 8 LHR at that time?

Cheers

S.B

 8 
 on: 04 January 2018, 02:06:59 pm 
Started by Frev - Last post by Frev

Happy New Year to you too Steve!

Not sure whether you missed him at all - as I do already have him in the database - so possibly passed on by you....

Hope you have a great year of research ahead of you  Wink
Cheers, Frev

 9 
 on: 02 January 2018, 10:32:58 pm 
Started by stevebecker - Last post by More Majorum
Hi Steve,

I have finally found some time to answer your questions, so my apologies for the delay.
What I record of the wounded for the 8th LH on the 26th May numbers eight, excluding Sgt Newland MGS. These I list below by Troop & Squadron with supporting statements where such having been made.

Sgt Ebden Harcourt Roger Palmer No. 41, “A” Troop, “A” Squadron’s WIA, in reserve trenches on Russell’s Top early in the morning, shrapnel wound to the right hip. He was taken down to the No.2 Field Ambulance at Anzac Cove. Evacuated Fleet Sweeper  “Clacton” 27/5/15, embarked for Malta onboard HS “Neuralia” 27/5/15, admitted to Valetta Military Hospital, Malta 4/6/15. Embarked for Egypt onboard HMT “Seang Bee” 15/7/15. Returned to duty 25/7/15.
Capt Day, 2I.C. “A” Sqdn, “Wakened at about 8 a.m. got to bed in hole about 4 a.m. hung clothes out to dry. Almost immediately after shrapnel burst near wounding three men. Four holes in blanket & WP sheet. Gun called “Latrine Ann”. 6 p.m. Latrine Ann has just been firing again. Sgt Palmer & trooper L. Cole wounded, fourteen reinforcements arrived this evening. On night shift to bed about four a.m. night quiet.”
Tpr Wilson: “Many of our troops hit early this morning. Two of  “C” Squadron and 3 of “A” Squadron.
Continual fire on trenches all night. Sgt Palmer wounded by shrapnel.”
Sgt Mulder “A” Troop, “C” Sqdn, stated in his diary: “They got onto us with their shrapnel guns today and wounded a few of our men. Sgt Palmer one of ours got it in the hip.”
Stan Mack “A” Troop, “A” Sqdn later wrote in a letter home; “It was shrapnel that brought poor old Roger Palmer down first time we were in the trenches. He heard the gun go off and made a dive for a small dugout, but fat Q.M. Fry got in before him… Roger did not get the bullet taken out of him but was quite all right and did not affect him in any way. For all that, he was supposed to go to England to have it removed. He was pining to get back to the front so one day, he stowed away on a train which was taking some of the 8th reinforcements and walked into the middle of “A” Troop while they were having breakfast. You can imagine the cheer, but he will be getting hurt for sure, he’s so game – but not careless like some others who have been wounded and killed.”


Tpr Frederick Leslie Penny No. 145, “C” Troop, “A” Sqdn, WIA gunshot wound to skull (severe), evacuated onboard HMHS “Dunluce Castle” to Egypt. Admitted to No. 15 General Hospital, Alexandria.


Sig Edgar Kent No. 131, “C” Troop, “A” Sqdn, shrapnel neck and in shoulder and punctured lung. Admitted to No. 2 Field Ambulance, Anzac Cove. Evacuated Fleet Sweeper “Clacton” 27/5/15, embarked for Malta onboard HS “Neuralia” 27/5/15, admitted to St. Andrews Hospital, 4/6/15. Embarked for England onboard HS “Delta” 6/7/15, RTA aboard HMAT “Runic” 7-11-1915. 
Sig Callow: “There were several casualties from our regiment by this morning. A hot fusillade took place at 3.30 a.m. this morning. Everyone was ordered into the trenches and reserves were brought up in case of a severe charge. It lasted till about 6.30 a.m. with several casualties. Signlr. E. Kent hit with shrapnel in shoulder, penetrating lungs.”

Tpr James Pullar Cameron No. 605 (686) “C” Troop, “A” Sqdn. Shrapnel wound to chest. Admitted to No. 2 Field Ambulance, 26/5/15. Evacuated onboard HS “Neuralia” to Malta, admitted to Military Hospital, Cootenera 4/6/15. Re-embarked for Gallipoli onboard HMT “Southland” 14/6/15, Returned to duty 20/6/15.

Tpr William Sydney Hinds No. 622, 2nd Reinforcements) “D” Troop, “A” Sqdn. WIA GSW right shoulder, admitted to No. 2 Field Ambulance, Anzac Cove, evacuated HMHS “Dunluce Castle” to Alexandria, admitted No. 1 Aust General Hospital, Heliopolis, 11/7/15.

Tpr Lionel Nelson Cole No. 155, “A” Sqdn, WIA by shrapnel, fractured left hand, admitted to No. 2 Field Ambulance, Anzac Cove. Evacuated to Mudros onboard the Fleet Sweeper “Clacton”, admitted to No. 1 Aust Stationary Hospital, Lemnos 27/5/15. Returned to duty 12/6/15.

Tpr William St.Vincent Moody (Moodie) No. 256, “B” Sqdn, shrapnel wound to jaw (fracture) and in the lower temple and ear, which bled furiously. Evacuated Fleet Sweeper “Clacton” 27/5/15, embarked for Malta onboard HS “Neuralia” 27/5/15, admitted to Valetta Military Hospital, Malta 4/6/15.

 Tpr Hugh Wright No. 655, “C” Sqdn, in reserve trenches Russell’s Top wounded by ricochet. GWS to scalp (slight) admitted to No. 2 Field Ambulance, Anzac Cove. Evacuated to HS “Franconia” via Fleet Sweeper “Clacton”, disembarked Alexandria, admitted to No 1 General Hospital, Heliopolis.
The MO Sid Campbell noted how he had been sent for at 5.30 a.m. to tend to some men who had been wounded by a bullet that had struck a sandbag, and had shattered on impact with fragments striking the men below in the trench.. He recorded that Tpr Hugh Wright had received scratches to the head and Tpr Bill Moodie had been hit in the ear and lower temple, which had ‘bled furiously’.
Tpr Doug Hill “C” Sqdn noted in his diary: “H. Wright wounded in the head. In the firing line. Seven of Third Bgde. wounded by shrapnel. Majestic at Cape Helles sunk by submarine.”


Sgt  William Andrew Newland No. 483. 8th LH Machine Gun Section. WIA shrapnel wound to chest, admitted to No. 2 Field Ambulance, Anzac Cove. Evacuated onboard HS “Dunluce Castle” to Alexandria, 27/5/15. Admitted to No. 2 General Hospital, Ghezireh 30/5/15. RTA 3/9/15 from Suez onboard HS “Ballarat”. Discharged 22/12/1915.

To try and answer your last question with regard to what Squadrons of the 8th LH manned the firing line trenches on the 26th May, the following is what I have been able to establish.

The 8th LH Regt War Diary records that The Regiment came under the command of General Russell and was allotted sector No. 4 on Walker’s Ridge and took over the trenches, relieving the NZMR Wellington Mounted Rifles.
The 8th moved out from the beach bivouac at 11a.m. and began the long climb up the cliff face on to Walkers’s Ridge, the climb was extremely difficult as occasional rain showers made the steep track very slippery. Halfway up, just as they had stopped for a rest, they heard a loud explosion out to sea directly of Gaba Tepe, and witnessed a huge water spout alongside the battleship HMS “Triumph”, which rapidly heeled over and began to sink. The 8th occupied the trenches at Walker’s Ridge at 2 p.m., and took up their positions in the firing line. The regiment was required to hold a front line of around 400 yards with each squadron manning about 200 yards of the firing line, this being undertaken by two squadrons holding the fire trenches and one squadron in the reserve trenches. The 8th LHR held the front trenches from Sap No. 5 through to Sap No.10, near the entrance to Bully Beef Sap and over looking Monash Valley (Section 1). The 9th LHR held the positions from No. 4 Sap through to No. 1 Sap (Section 2) and nightly a patrol of one Sergeant and twelve men occupied Turk’s Point until dawn the next morning. Each firing line section was again divided into two sub-sections, (I &II) with the reserve troops occupying sub-section No.3 (III). Those Troops not manning the front line trenches (Supports) were held in the reserve trenches off the Main Street trench line. Each Squadron had a front that took two troops always on guard while the other two were in the trench behind as reserve. The troops in the firing line had two days (48 hours) on duty, and then they were relieved by the reserve troops who moved up and took their places.
Cpl Pickett, “B” Troop, “B” Sqdn, under heading, “In the supporting trenches, 24th May.” He outlines the events for these two days: “We spent several days in our dug outs and I missed all the outpost duties as I had 4 days ‘spell’ before I came into the trenches. We had to climb up a cut path up the cliffs – a climb of about ½ a mile with a full pack on and a supply of fire wood each. I think it would be about 90 lbs. altogether so we were all pretty well done up when we got to our trenches. We are dug in pretty well and fire through loopholes. The trenches are all zigzag so we cannot be fired at from a flank. We are in here for a week and we are 24 hours on and same off. When we are off we go to our dug outs which are built along the cliffs & in the spot where we are there is a drop of 150 feet. We have just got the password through (Hastings) and no-one is allowed along who cannot give it.
Sgt Colin Cameron: “Our regiment went into the trenches.  “B” Squadron left bivouac at 12 a.m. fully equipped and reached their part of trench in pouring rain at about 2 p.m.  “A” and “B” Troops in the firing trench and “C” and “D” as supports. Watched warship Triumph being sunk by torpedo on our way.”
Tpr Carl Holmberg, “C” Troop, “B” Sqdn: “8th Reg entered the reserve trenches.”
Tpr Wilson, “B” Troop, “B” Sqdn: “Battleship Triumph torpedoed and sunk about 1 p.m. Moved into the  trenches this afternoon. Shrapnel fairly close. Turkish trenches about 450 yds away. Had a couple of shots.”


The situation for Wednesday 26th May was: Firing line occupied by two troops each, “A”& “C” Squadrons, “B” Sqdn in reserve. “C” & “D” Troops of “A” Sqdn and two Troops of “C” Sqdn unknown. Two Troops of “B” Sqdn moved up into the firing line when the Turkish artillery opened fire.
Just after 3.30 am the Turkish gun known as ‘Latrine Annie’ opened fire onto Russell’s Top. The barrage opened up again just after 5.30 am.

Cheers,

Jeff

 10 
 on: 02 January 2018, 10:57:55 am 
Started by Frev - Last post by stevebecker
Frev,

Still double checking some men pays off.

Found another I missed

EURELL   William Patrick   255   Pte   01 LHR   B Sqn T/att 6 LHR 3-15 evac to St Andrews hosp Malta (enteric) 7-15 rtn 9-15 (G) att WFF to T/Cpl (from kelly) 5-16 revert 5-16 to L/Cpl 6-16 to T/Cpl (from forsyth) 8-16 to trade test AFC 10-16 to 68 Sqn (2 Sqn) AFC (255a) 10-16 to MT Dvr 1/AM B Flight 3-17 to hosp 9-17 to 1 Wing HQ Cirencester UK 1-18 to NME UK butchering 4-19 married Lilian Winchcombe at Cirencester 5-8-18 (D Troop CSqn/11 LH CMF) brothers John AFC, Thomas DAC and George AIF depot


Cheers and Happy New year

S/B

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